tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6131263685211526286.post8758711357970185463..comments2024-02-19T09:21:26.257+01:00Comments on EUCALYPTOLOGICS: GIT Forestry Consulting Information Resources on Eucalyptus Cultivation Worldwide: American Plantsman Discovers Eucalyptus HybridGus-GITForestryhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07330075691723312453noreply@blogger.comBlogger2125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6131263685211526286.post-25552744024025276062008-11-04T01:23:00.000+01:002008-11-04T01:23:00.000+01:00Posted by Gus on 2/26/2008, 2:58 am, in reply to "...Posted by Gus on 2/26/2008, 2:58 am, in reply to "Re: American Plantsman Discovers Eucalyptus Hybrid (our Ian Barclay, of course!)"<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://www.adb.online.anu.edu.au/biogs/A100375b.htm" REL="nofollow">Joseph Maiden</A> says (by 1924) about <B><I>E. irbyii</I></B> (named by <A HREF="http://www.adb.online.anu.edu.au/biogs/A070154b.htm" REL="nofollow">Baker & Smith</A>, 1920): <BR/><BR/><I>"The type comes from Alma Tier, Interlaken, Tasmania, growing amongst E. Gunnii (<B>L. G. Irby</B>, now Conservator of Forests of that State) and so far it has not been found out of that island."</I> (...) <I>"<B>Some of the fruits are so like the hemispherical form of E. Gunnii, that when the material was first collected it was placed tentatively with that species</B> until other characters could be worked out, but it is, however, a much coarser plant morphologically than that species" </I><BR/><BR/>So it was a Tasmanian "non standard looking <I>E. gunnii</I>" that <B>Mr. Llewellyn George Irby</B> found and Baker & Smith described. <BR/><BR/><I>"from which species it differs in the physical features of its bark lacking the sweet nature of the sap of E. Gunnii, which can always be obtained by cutting the bark, and from which it derives its common name of “Cider Gum.” <B>In foliage it is not unlike E. Dalyrmpleana J.H.M.</B> Its affinities lie equally between E. viminalis, on the one hand, and E. Gunnii, on the other, so that, in a systematic arrangement, it might be placed between these two."</I> <BR/><BR/>Maiden comments Baker & Smith's description of Irby's finding: <BR/><BR/><I>"<B>Mr. L. G. Irby thought at first it was E. viminalis</B> from the abnormal (juvenile, J.H.M.) leaves, but noted its differences in other respects from the normal material of that species collected in other localities in Tasmania during his trip. An exhaustive oil determination, made since publishing our Research on the Eucalypts of Tasmania in Journ. Roy. Soc. (Tas.), 1912, confirmed our suspicion that it was new. In that paper it was placed tentatively under E. viminalis. The chief specific differences from this latter are the broader abnormal (juvenile, J.H.M.) and normal leaves, both of which are much coarser than those of E. viminalis"</I> (...) <I>"<B>The fruits are, however, identical in shape with those of E. Gunnii.</B>"</I> <BR/><BR/><BR/>So George, I have no idea what it really was but it could easily have been: <BR/><BR/>- <I>E. gunnii</I> x <I>dalrympleana</I> <BR/>- <I>E. gunnii</I> x <I>viminalis </I><BR/><BR/>There is an <A HREF="http://setis.library.usyd.edu.au/images/Ebind/docs/p00109/crge211.jpg" REL="nofollow"><I>E. irbyi</I> botanical plate</A> by <A HREF="http://www.anbg.gov.au/biography/flockton-lilian.html" REL="nofollow">Margaret Flockton</A> . There you can see it has juvenile "Gunnii-ish" leaves, but adult "Dalrympleana-ish" leaves. <BR/><BR/>What is sure is that sometime after Maiden writing that, the general belief was towards <I>E. gunnii</I> x <I>dalrympleana</I>. So soon afterwards, it moved from "<I>E. irbyii</I>" to "x <I>E. irbyii</I>", considered as hybrid. <BR/><BR/>Assuming it was an hybrid, in this case it was a natural cross, whatever the parents were. I rather consider the more modern French hybrids (man-made) as <A HREF="http://git-forestry-blog.blogspot.com/2007/09/cold-hardy-eucalyptus-dalrympleana-in.html" REL="nofollow"><I>E. gundal</I></A>. Because time and location differences for the different strains. Also because that is its commercial name. <I>E. irbyii</I> has been forgotten as time passed by (except by those liking the old stories ) :-)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6131263685211526286.post-67440768614878893142008-11-04T00:42:00.000+01:002008-11-04T00:42:00.000+01:00Posted by georgeinbandon,oregon on 2/25/2008, 2:08...Posted by georgeinbandon,oregon on 2/25/2008, 2:08 pm, in reply to "American Plantsman Discovers Eucalyptus Hybrid (our Ian Barclay, of course!)"<BR/><BR/>congratz Ian and thanks for sharing Gus. btw, i thought that crosses between gunnii and dalrympleana were called <B><I>E. x irbyii</I></B> or is the name obsolete or my memory defective??Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com